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Hi Magnat - welcome back,

Do you have a record of your original request to close your account in 2021?

What happened after you asked to re-open your account? Were you allowed to play immediately?

Thanks

ThePOGG

I do have that. They asked few questions and then after 7 days my account was reopened.

I have understood that if account is permanently closed due gambling addiction, it cant be ever reopened. What would be the point of even doing this, if you can get your account reopened again whenever you want?

So just asking these questions casinos is allowed to reopen an account like this, no matter the fact that at one point account is closed due addiction? Also like I said this happened right after I sent them email regarding addiction questions, I didnt even ask that by myself.

So I sent them email like this: Message received 13/11/2023 - 09:13:
Hello. If you would know my account is closed here due addiction and I come to ask that am I still 
allowed to use your sistersite. How would you answer this?

After this they said we dont have sistersite anymore, would you like to reopen your account?

Also they immediately closed my account when i sent them email asking what was the reason I closed my account earlier.

I think it should be standard to check what has been the original account closure reason and refuse to reopen an account if it has been addiction. They were able to check it when i asked so, so why not before they reopened my account.

And to make sure, I havent at any point asked to reopen my account. They said that you can try to reopen your account, I said okay. Then they sent me four questions which I answered to. Still regardless these questions, they could have easily check why my account is closed in the first place. 

From that closure conversation you can see I came to ask when did I close my account and is it permanent closure. They said it is not, by answering questions you can get it reopened. After that I said that I want permanent closure due my gambling addiction. They said we will close your account permanently now.

What is weird also is the fact that the email I contacted them and where they sent email saying that you can try to reopen your account wasnt even an email I had on my gaming account. So basically I have answered these questions they sent from an email that wasnt connected in any way to my gaming account. Later on they changed that email. I dont have any idea how you can get your account reopened from an email that wasnt even your email you had on your profile then. Basically they didnt identify me in any way and still the account was reopened.

I didnt know why my account was even closed. After some time I asked about that. What was the reason for my original account closure. Soon after my account was permanently blocked.

I have asked this from multiple sites and most have said it is not allowed to reopen an account like that and this is a rule that mga has set. Im curious to know is there any rule regarding this or not? Is It allowed for a casino to be the one suggesting account reopening, even for someone who contacts with question regarding addiction? If this kind of account is allowed to reopen, what kind of terms there is for it? 

I really do know that I have a responsibility too. However with the facts being that I already informed a casino that I want to be permanently blocked from there due my gambling addiction, and also when I never contacted them in the first place hoping to reopen an account. What I see is that this casino just dont care at all. They havent answer any of my questions or concerns. There isnt a single fact regarding my complaint that they would of have provided, such as MGA rule where their decision would be based to. 

Even if I wouldnt get any refund, I would like to get some clear answer that is it really allowed for casinos to behave like this under MGA? Is there even any rule that would protect vulnerable people, such as addicts?

Hi Magnat,

Do you have a record of your original request to close your account in 2021? If so, can you please provide it?

The protections that the licensee would be expected to provide vary depending on the nature of the language you used when requesting the closure of your account. So the original closure request is of a high degree of significance to any response we offer you right now.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Yes I have that and I can send it. I also have other emails from them if those will be needed.

I have now sent this email complaints@thepogg.com every document I have at the moment. I'm still missing the ones that would show that the email I contacted them wasnt my original gaming account email and they only changed that days later when they already decided that my account can be reopened.  I hope my answers for their questions wouldnt take away the responsibility from the casinos side. Also you will see from those documents that I didnt contact them in the first place to get my account reopened, and I wish that wouldnt have come on their mind to suggest that.

I needed to use translate as the original document isnt english. For the closing conversation I used word gambling addiction, not gaming addiction as it shows.

Only what I have found from MGA site is this:

Removing a self-exclusion can only be implemented following the account holders request, whereby the player must:
Provide an explanation why the self-exclusion was requested.
Provide evidence that they are now able to manage their gambling safely and sustainably.

Does this also mean permanent ban due gambling addiction? Also, does this take away responsibility from the casino to check the original closure reason? Can the evidence said there be just yes, I am?

Even if they have acted right and I cant get the refund due my answers for their questions, I think it would be nice that casinos wouldn't suggest reopening to anyone. It would be more responsible that this would always come up first from a customer, never from casinos side. At least dont do this to someone who you already see contacting you regarding addiction. Even if my intention wouldn't be getting to play when contacting a casino, if i have an addiction and casino suggests reopening an account it is extremely hard to defend yourself not going for it.

Also if there would have been any withdraw, I think they would have had any right to keep winnings due previous addiction closure? At least I have seen some cases regarding that.

If they think they haven't made any mistake regarding this, then why my account gets permanently closed soon after I asked them what was the reason for my original account closure. If they were able to check this when I asked to, then I dont really know why this wasn't done before considering my account reopening.

Hi Magnat,

I've reviewed what you sent through and unfortunately there's nothing we can do to assist you in this matter.

You originally closed your account on the 02/03/2019. This was just a standard closure, not a self-exclusion. As such, you were free to re-open your account at any time.  

You then contacted the operator on the 21/12/2021 to ask about the nature of your account closure. During this conversation you asked the agent to apply a "permanent ban due to gambling addiction".

Under MGA regulations, the operator are now required to keep your account closed, unless you specifically request that the account be re-opened, and where that request occurs, they are still required to apply a 7 day cooling-off period.

On the 13/11/2023 you contacted the operator asking "my account is closed here due to addiction and I come to ask that am I still
allowed to use your sister site." This question isn't asking whether your self-exclusion applies to sister sites. It asks whether you can play with sister sites, clearly signposting your intention to play. The agent informs you that Lucky Casino no longer has any sister sites, but you can request to reopen your account.

You responded to this email notifying the operator that you would like to reopen your account. The operator responded to you asking some questions which you answered as follows:

- What was the reason for closing your game account?  I wanted to take a break

- What has changed since then? I can take playing more sensibly

- Do you feel you can play at a level you can afford – time and money? yes

- Are you aware of our responsible gaming tools and where can you find information about them? yes I am

On the 14/11/2023 the operator responded to your request to re-open your account stating that it had been approved but that a 7 day cooling-off period would have to be completed first and that you could request that your account be re-opened no earlier than the 21/11/2023.

All of the above is in line with the MGA license requirements. This is not a case of the operator promting you to play when you had contacted them about a self-exclusion. You contacted the operator expressing a clear intention to play with another property on the Glitnor license. The agent simply responded providing your options.

While we understand your frustrations, the operator has acted in exact accordance with the requirements set out in their license.

Sorry we cannot be of further help.

ThePOGG

I dont agree. I contacted them regarding another case I had, not that I wanted to play with them. I had case under arctic casino regarding lisence block and I actually got refunded. So there is none protection towards addiction it seems like. Not any permanent block that would protect addicts. I have contacted multiple sites, and they all say they cant reopen an account, once closed due addiction and this is a rule set by MGA. So why other casinos has different rules?

Also like I said the email I contacted them wasnt my gaming account email, they didnt identify who this person was until they already decided to reopen an account.

If you really think this responsible acting then okay. I can say 95 % casinos would have refunded on a case like this. Even some curacao sites. I have copied you mga rules. I have not Provided any evidence that my gaming is under control at the moment, also I didnt contact them to asking to reopen my account. I had a case with arctic casino where I actually got refunded.

Seems weird that you said on other cases that operators have responsibility onlt if you have said gambling addiction when you had closed an account due addiction. All the sudden it isnt right that anymore?

Weird Indeed that it is just totally fine for someone contacting casino regarding addiction, and they think hey you can try to reopen an account without any concern. This is really okay acting in your opinion? Like I said mga says you need to provide evidence that your gaming is now under control. So the evidence is okay to be just saying yes? I have always thought mga is really responsible and an account once blocked due addiction, wont ever get reopened. You dont just recover from an addiction within two years.

I can give you proof from arctic casino that clearly shows I was able to play on arctic casino when blocked from ibet due addiction. I got refunded due that after. I asked this same question over 10 sites maybe. NO other than Lucky casino answered saying anything about reopening an account. All other asked clearly to my question that No, you cant do that Under MGA. This is NOT that I wanted to play, this question was due my other case I had. It is not nice for you to even say that to someone who is sick and wouldnt want to play casinos. Like I said I wouldnt never reopened my account without casino suggesting it!

Also if I say if you would know my account HERE is closed due an gambling addiction. So can you really say a casino didnt know this is an addict contacting us?

You seriously clearly see someone contacting a casino regarding an addiction, and you just say everything that has happened is allowed? They know this is an addict sending us an email. So no need to protect or prevent her using our site? Are you really serious? This was email sent regarding to get an opinion on different sites regarding mga rules. This was regarding a case I had with arctic casino, where I had  a block due addiction at ibet and I was allowed to play on arctic casino. This was resolved after and I got refund. All can be prooven.

"The protections that the licensee would be expected to provide vary depending on the nature of the language you used when requesting the closure of your account."

I contact casino making sure my account is permanently blocked due addiction without option to reopen. For you this isnt enough to get protection. Then what is?

I sent you screenshot regarding my search history from 11 november 2023. Also I have asked arctic casino to sent proof that I had a case with them regarding sistersite block due addiction and that resolved to a refund. That happened 10 november 2023 and I got refunded 13 november after I had sent that message to Lucky casino. Why I contacted to casinos was to get different opinions regarding sistersite block under MGA as that was something I was going on with this other lisence. NOT in any way to get playing. Why do you even think someone says addiction if they would like to go to casino to play? If I would like to do that I would never expose my addiction to a casino as I know that should leave a ban and casinos shouldnt accept players like that. I think that is extremely rude to make these kind of false assumption out of nowhere. Like I said I have a responsibility too but can you really say without lying that this casino has acted responsible when they know this is an addict person contacting us? I need to say you have a interesting point of view and I dont think the way you look things right here is equal.

This is also good warning to all that with these few questions casinos can wipe away all the responsibility. Even if you have one time blocked yourself permanently without possibility to reopen, casino can later to reopen an account. Also if you contact them with an email that clearly says you have an addiction, if just someone has an idea that you were trying to get playing, then this was totally your fault and not casinos. I didnt ask to get my account reopened, I asked opinion regarding addiction matters. So, addiction block dont actually bring you any protection and it is same as normal self-exclusion. MGA isnt actually anything nowadays regarding these matters. There is even multiple curacao sites that dont reopen accounts if there has been closure due addiction. No matter what you would say nowadays.

Hi Magnat,

I'm sorry to hear you feel that way. However it does not change our ruling in this case.

The language used does impact the protections that the operator is expected to offer. You made clear that your request was related to gambling addiction, so you were afforded the maximum protections that the MGA license requires operators to provide - your exclusion would apply to all properties on the same license as Lucky Casino and if you requested to re-open your account, the operator has to ask basic questions to confirm your understanding that you are in control of your play and ensure that a 7 day cooling off period is enforced. 

All of this was applied appropriately and correctly. Our opinions on whether the MGA license could offer stronger protections are not in question. You received exactly the protections you were entitled to based on the regulations as they were in force at the time of your play.

And to be clear - there is no provision within the MGA license for an account to be closed without the possibility to be re-opened. Only to close your account and put in place some protections to slow down re-opening.

Whether you had some other agenda in contacting this operator to ask if you would be allowed to play at other properties on their license is moot. The language used provides reasonable grounds for the operator to interpret this as a request to reaccess play.

I would also highlight that when you last approached this service to manage a complaint for you, in August this year, we signposted <a href="https://betblocker.org" target="_blank">BetBlocker</a> to you multiple times, a free app that allows you to restrict your devices from being able to access only gambling sites like Lucky Casino. We would again recommend that you engage with this or some other similar app to restrict your access to gambling.

Finally, I would make clear that the ruling of this service has no legal bearing in this case, not does it restrict your rights to pursue your claim via other avenues.

Sorry we cannot be of further assistance.

ThePOGG

So in other words MGA doesn't provide any permanent self-exclusion? At least gambling addiction don't bring that. I have also conversations left with other casinos regarding this where I discuss this with them. From these conversations it is seen that im not trying to get playing. Im discussing MGA rules. 

Request to reaccess to play from someone addicted. Good responsible acting Indeed from casinos side. This has been the only casino I have seen under mga to act this way. When i have asked this now from multiple sites, they say what mga says account like these cant ever be reopened. It is nice to see some take responsible matters and vulnerable protection seriously, when others couldnt care less!

So normal self-exclusion and block due gambling addiction is the same? So there is No need even say gambling addiction when it actually dont bring any more protection. It is just normal self exclusion.


Removing a self-exclusion can only be implemented following the account holders request, whereby the player must:
Provide an explanation why the self-exclusion was requested.
Provide evidence that they are now able to manage their gambling safely and sustainably.

These didnt happen on my case. I didnt provide any evidence, also following the account holders request. I didnt clearly request this. But seems like casinos really dont have to follow MGA rules that strictly.

Even if this would be to get reaccess to play, it seems like casinos is allowed to suggest reopening by themselves even to someone who just said the word addiction?

Also how they even know who this person was? Like I have said many times, they didnt identify me in any way. This email wasnt connected to my gaming account. By the time this was just some random contacting them. When I answered these questions they couldnt know who this person was or do she even have any account here! They identify me many days after they already agreed to reopen an account.

Also if this really is correct. Then can casinos also deny withdraw if you have one time closed account due addiction? I have seen many cases like that. Also if everything has done correct, then why they immediately closed my account when i asked reason for my original account closure?

So let just be clear here. The maximum protection MGA provides is that you can reopen an account? I have understood that MGA has been very strict regarding matters like these but I guess I have been wrong or something has changed recently.

So even when casinos says your account is now permanently closed due addiction, it is actually not and you can reopen it when you like? What is the point of MGA lisence anymore when many curacao sites has more strict rules even.

Hi Magnat,

If you ask to close your account, permanently or otherwise, the operator are under no obligation to stop you if you ask to reopen your account.

If you ask to self-exclude your account, but don't mention gambling addiction, if you request to reopen your account the operator has to enforce a 24h cooling off period in case of a defined exclusion (i.e. 1 month) or a 7 day cooling off period for an undefined exclusion (i.e. "permanently).

If you ask to self-exclude your account and mention gambling addiction, the same protections apply but the licensee also has to carry over the exclusion to other properties on the license.

These are the strongest protections that the MGA license has ever offered.

I'm very sorry you're unhappy, but this case is clear cut. You are welcome to take your case up via other channels but there's nothing further that we can do to assist you. No further posts will be approved on this thread.

ThePOGG

Found for the Operator - Lucky Casino adhered to the MGA license requirements exactly in their management of this player.

This casino reopened my account that was closed 2021 PERMANENTLY due my gambling addiction. I sent them email asking opinion that if my account would be closed here due gambling addiction, would i still be able to use sistersite. After this they asked that would you like to reopen your account. They have denied refund based on that I asked to reopen account. 

Lucky Casino - reopened permanently closed account due gambling addiction 

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